Opinion: Harris has adapted to changing media reality. It's time journalism does the same.
“This is not the 1950s anymore,” said Vice President Kamala Harris, dismissing those critical of her for not having biological children. But that comment, from her recent interview with the popular “Call Her Daddy” podcast, could have easily described the ever-evolving state of journalism.
“Call Her Daddy” was the second most listened to podcast on Spotify last year and the fifth most listened to podcast among U.S. women. Each week, millions of fans tune in for talk about relationships, sex, mental health and other popular topics. The choice for the Democratic presidential nominee to go on a platform with such a large female audience makes sense.
"At the end of the day, I couldn't see a world in which one of the main conversations in this election is women, and I'm not a part of it," explained Alex Cooper, host and cocreator of the podcast. "I'm so aware I have a very mixed audience when it comes to politics, so please hear me when I say my goal today is not to change your political affiliation."
The discussion between Harris and Cooper erred on the tamer side of the podcast’s more raunchy subject matter. Most of their conversation was spent speaking about issues that impact women, like abortion and sexual violence.
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Harris has kept national interviews at a minimum. What does that say about our industry?
Harris has been scolded by the news media and her opponent for not doing enough traditional interviews. (Mind you, her opponent refuses to do a second debate and recently pulled out of an interview with "60 Minutes.")
An Axios article from last month reported that Harris had only done three interviews as of July 21, when President Joe Biden dropped out the race and endorsed his vice president. Axios excluded interviews with “partisan-leaning commentators,” which removed her interviews with various radio hosts.
Harris’ choice to forgo traditional news outlets on the presidential campaign trail reflects a trend of media figures choosing interviews with “influencers” over actual journalists. This trend is also indicative of legacy media’s diminishing dominance in our culture.
Many journalists, myself included, have wrestled with the reality that traditional news outlets are no longer the gatekeepers of mass communication. Over the past decade, the growth of social media has allowed politicians to speak directly to their audiences without the press. This allows them to have total control over their message, without a journalist holding their feet to the fire.
Soft interviews conducted by non-journalists also offer politicians and public figures a place to present their platform without pushback. The “Call Her Daddy” interview went on without Cooper asking follow-up questions or pushing Harris for more direct answers. The vice president essentially regurgitated her usual talking points and relayed very little new information.
To be fair, Harris has done more traditional interviews. She sat down with reporters from the National Association of Black Journalists who pressed her on Gaza and reparations for slavery. Her interview with "60 Minutes" aired Monday night.
The state of journalism isn’t as secure as it once was. Local publications are shutting down left and right, the internet has become a cesspool of misinformation and the public has shown decreasing trust in the news media as a whole. Journalists are left fighting to hold on to their credibility.
Media personalities – not just politicians – are increasingly seeing interviews as an extension of public relations. Questions are pre-screened, subjects give non-answer after non-answer without any pressure for a direct response and uncomfortable questions are ignored by both parties. Accountability is an obvious threat to the brand.
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Perhaps it's time for journalists to adapt
Harris’ conversation on “Call Her Daddy” wasn’t a bad interview – it wasn’t really an interview at all. Cooper gave Harris space to give thoughtful answers to rather heavy questions for her young, female and largely apolitical audience. There weren’t any interruptions nor attempts for Harris to give headline-ready, clickbait-prime responses.
Getting in front of young people is imperative to the Harris campaign. Its social media accounts, under the username @KamalaHQ, have a pulse on youth culture. They take advantage of internet memes to mobilize young voters as this demographic increasingly turns to social media for information rather than national news outlets.
A journalist's job is to hold truth to power, and voters would be better served if Harris gave more interviews to traditional, trained journalists to get to the heart of the issues. Journalists know how to ask questions and get hard answers.
But perhaps traditional journalists’ focus on eradicating bias has flattened issues and turned away potential audiences. Maybe political pundits have turned national news media into a place for pontification rather than earnest conversation.
The hand-wringing from old-guard journalists about politicians avoiding them resulted from a very valid fear of quality journalism fading into irrelevance. National news outlets often berate Harris for refusing to give them the interviews they want. But it's time for our industry to do some self-interrogation. It's our job to adapt with a changing media landscape, lest we be left behind.
Kofi Mframa is a columnist and digital producer for USA TODAY and the USA TODAY Network.